topic Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong" in Energy Accounts & Plans

Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

JeffreyT — Mon, 31 Aug 2020 09:39:59 GMT

BACKGROUND

Let me set the scene. We are two people in a house (in our sixties) and our electricity bill has been around $1000 each quarter for over 12 months. Around 50-60 kWh average daily usage. Now this is really really high for two people, no dependants, in a house on our own. However we have lived with it, even though the little "house" picture shows us that we ae using far more electricity that others in the area.

THE LATEST BILL

To our horror, the latest bill is $2307.71. A jump of over 100%! 100kWH average daily usage.

TO BE CLEAR

We have not changed anything. We have not added a new appliance, a new washing machine, nothing. What has changed is that AGL installed a Smart Meter in March this year. That's the change.

The little house picture shows that we are using the equivalent of 20 people's electricity compared to houses in the area! There are two of us.

MY CONVERSATIONS

I have now spoken to frontline support a AGL, someone in the resolution team, and a manger in the resolution team. Here is the story I am given:

The reading are correct because AGL says they are
If they check the meter and it is faulty then we have to pay for the fact they checked the meter
The onus is on us to invalidate their readings
The bill is correct....because the bill is correct...unless we can prove otherwise
We have to turn everything off in the house and spend time messing about with appliances (where we know there has not been a change) to prove to AGL that their bill is faulty
Otherwise, the bill stands because.... it is their bill!

HOWEVER

AGL is providing a service to us, and we are entitled to pay fair value for a service rendered. This is an impossible bill, and we should not have to pay for a service incorrectly rendered
If AGL installed a smart meter, it is their meter that is making the readings, their system that is doing the calculation, and their system that is generating the invoice. It is beyond belief that AGSL says "trust us because you should" when a bill is provided that cannot, just cannot be correct.
We did not ask for a meter change. AGL put in a "smart meter" for, on the surface, to SAVE MONEY on the people who now do not need to read meters, and, on the surface, to institute some sort of scam where they can now charge double, with the response: it is what it is (heard that somewhere else?)

And the onus is totally thrown back on us to prove them wrong.

This totally unacceptable.

I am going to write to AGL one more time, and then straight to the media and the ombudsman. I cannot be alone receiving this appalling behaviour, and it is time that companies like AGL start to realise that there are customers with rights, and the supplier's role is to serve the customer, not to issue bills based on calculations that the consumer has zero control over, and then put the onus back on the customer to prove them wrong.

Does this resonate with anyone else?

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

DHoiberg — Tue, 01 Sep 2020 05:49:35 GMT

absolutely my experience at the moment - i have tried to get on their telephone support line and two times their line just drops out. The ombudsman will be my next call as well

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

JeffreyT — Wed, 02 Sep 2020 07:51:50 GMT

It appears no-one from AGL bothers to read these and reply either

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

David_AGL — Thu, 03 Sep 2020 01:45:17 GMT

Hi @JeffreyT , it's difficult to address issues like this within the community because we don't have access to your account or the history of this case. You've stated that you intend to speak to the Resolutions team again, and that's the course of action I would advise. There is also the Complaints form on this page if you'd prefer to go down that route.

There are a whole range of factors that can contribute to unexpectedly high bills, and without some investigation and troubleshooting it can be difficult to say what factor or combination of factors is to blame in this case. A faulty smart meter is rare, but it is one possible cause, so having that looked into may be worthwhile. As far as I'm aware, you would only be responsible for the cost of a technician if the meter is found to not be faulty, so it makes sense for you to rule out other possibilities first.

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

JeffreyT — Thu, 03 Sep 2020 02:17:53 GMT

Hi David

Thanks for the response.

I have already written to the dispute resolution team as a last resort. The to the ombudsman to help resolve this.

The issue I have is exactly the issue you raise - it is up to ME to prove the bill wrong, even though I am the customer The only assistance AGL offers, as a service provider, is to "check the meter" and a bunch of web links. I don't find that satisfactory at all i.e. the bill is always right, unless someone can prove it wrong.

For the amount of money paid in the lifetime of a customer (say, 60 years at $4000/year - $240,000) you would expect a process where AGL would be able to provide some support e.g. send someone out (yes, at AGL:'s cost) to assess what could be going wrong, either at our end or at AGL's end.

The concept of "you are the customer, however we will charge what we like unless you can prove we are wrong" is from the dark ages. Most other companies have discarded this approach, as they realise that positive word of mouth and a focus on the customer leads to huge growth for the business.

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

David_AGL — Thu, 03 Sep 2020 05:11:00 GMT

@JeffreyT , I hear you and I absolutely agree that positive word of mouth is invaluable. Customer satisfaction matters a great deal to everyone I know at AGL.

I think it's not so much that the onus is on the customer to "prove the bill is wrong" but rather that the customer is usually in a much better position than AGL to assess the most common causes of a high bill within their own household - for example, are there new or faulty appliances, changed usage patterns or environment, estimated bills, and so on.

It's a challenge to address, because bill shock is a common issue and in the vast majority of cases the cause of the increased usage is something more common than a faulty meter. If a technician was sent to check for meter faults as the initial step in every report of a high bill, this would result in everyone paying a great deal more on every bill, even if only a portion of the cost was passed along!

None of this is to say AGL doesn't make mistakes, of course we can and do get things wrong sometimes and will always try to remedy those situations.

I hope this is resolved to your satisfaction soon. Please do drop back again and let us know when you discover what the cause was - you never know what might be helpful to other people having the same problems. One customer I recall who found their usage mysteriously high eventually discovered after almost a year that their neighbour's electrician had wired a new air-conditioner onto their meter rather than their neighbour's!

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

AGLtheftvictim — Fri, 12 Mar 2021 01:04:11 GMT

Hello, did you manage do solve your issue ? I am having exactly the same problem. Our bill shows we are consuming 50 times more than a normal house, the bill is obviously wrong, and yet they are insisting we need to pay this bill. My next step is fairtrade as well...

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

NeilC — Fri, 19 Mar 2021 05:35:01 GMT

@AGLtheftvictim

Go out and read your meter, note down all of the readings. (You could take photos)

24 Hours later do the same readings.

Convert the readings into consumption and then review it.

If you still think it is incorrect then you can ask that your meter be checked (think that this is about a $750 fee) if the check proves the meter is correct then you pay.

A good example of this is when people install an illegal solar system and instead of you reducing your bill the meter charges you for output from the system.

A good electrician should be able to examine your system in about an hour and diagnose your issues.

If you have a remote meter you could download your CSV file and if you like send me a private message and I will send you an email address to send the file to me then analyse your data for free.

If you don't want to do this you can ask AGL to send you a NEM format file and if you understand spread sheets you can look up how to read the data and do it yourself.

Does you bill state that it is a read or a estimate?

In the pages here is story that one user was being charged for the next door neighbours flat.

Once again, if the readings are true the AGL will charge you for electricity going through the meter.

Its now up to you to proceed as you wish.

Cheers

Neil

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

NeilC — Thu, 08 Apr 2021 09:16:42 GMT

@JeffreyT

Hi Jeffery,

It would be really nice if you came back here and gave some feed-back on the end result.

Was it something like, your hot water service was wired to your peak demand circuit.

I would have been horrified at using 50-60Kw a week, let alone a day.

Cheers

Neil

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

Ahalyap — Sun, 27 Nov 2022 01:02:57 GMT

We are a house of 2 a single dad to 15 year old. Last year I had my ex living with me who would use the heater and the air on all the time.. my second quarter bill last year was around $400 and this year it came to $780… I called up agl.. they asked me to take pictures and the agent came back saying it should be $900… that’s ridiculous I got all appliances checked.. and there were no surge how can the price increase by 80%….

however I let that go and paid the bill they sent me a $2022.82 bill and that is after a meter reading..

this is robbery at broad day light.. I cannot afford this electricity.. my daughter and me are trying very hard to save every cent and we never switched on the air on or heaters.. got our landlord to service the water heater… no way the 2 of us can run up that bill, considering I do 2 jobs and my 15 year old is studying and working all evening.. we spend less than 11 hours at night at home and shower only in the morning to save on costs..

feels like this company is out to steal money from us… I’m not going to go down with out a fight..

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

NeilC — Sun, 27 Nov 2022 08:11:46 GMT

@Ahalyap

The first thing I would do if I was you is learn how to read your Meter.

Then start taking your own meter readings and writing them down (try and do at least once a day at approximately the same time).

Next log onto your AGL account and see what your current rates are.

This is the top of the screen you should see when you log in.

Click on the down arrow next to your user name.

You should see the above list.

Click on account settings.

You should see a screen similar to above.

Click on Property and Plans

You should see your plan now on the left

Click on the View icon

Now you know what you are being charged for.

You haven't mentioned what sort of meter you have, if its a smart meter you can down load your data from your AGL web page and possibly work out your daily usage.

To get a $2000 bill that means you are paying $22.00 a day. (90 day billing cycle).

If you would like to Private Message me (and you have a Smart Meter) you could send me a copy of your Download file and I can do an analysis of it for you for free.

There are a multitude of things that you can do to track down your usage but unless you can really read your smart meter they are hard to analyze.

By the way changing retailers will not help as they all rely on the meter readings whether they are manual or smart meters.

Your best option is to continue on using DATA to prove your point.

Now just to make you even happier, we are a two person house, I am retired and the lady of the house is still working.

We have solar and only use evaporative AC to cool the house.

Below is our predicting electrical usage for our final quarter bill for 2022.

So the above is a prediction based on our daily usage over the last 44 days.

We have a heat pump Hot Water system set to reheat from 10:30 in the morning (thus using our generated solar).

Our reverse cycle Inverter AC unit is switched off at the circuit board (do you know that AC Inverter Types use 3kW of power a day just keeping the oil warm).

We do our washing between 10 and 3 during the day as this is cheaper, never use a hot water wash unless its really necessary.

Even silly things like when you want to make a cuppa you only put enough water in the kettle as you need (why heat 1.5 litres when you only need 500mL).

We don't own a dryer and hang up clothes to dry on a clothes line. (Under the verandah, carport or on a drying rack inside if necessary).

Hopefully the above is maybe pointing as to where your high usage is being used

Cheers

Neil

If you like my reply please take the time to click the like button to show your appreciation for the response.

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

twaltisbuhl — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 01:49:27 GMT

SAME SITUATION! I'm absolutely disgusted at my current 'estimated' bill. They've told me that it's based on historical usage and seasonal. NEVER have I once had to pay anywhere near this amount. It's double any other bill we've ever had. We are a two person household and NOTHING has changed. There is no additional usage, no additional appliances, nothing to account for this rise. I entered our actual meter read and now they've decided that it's even higher. COMPLETE RUBBISH. The estimates provided over the past six months have been WOEFUL. And now to be slugged with this is DISGUSTING. Their chat assistants seems to be bots that only have the most rudimentary functions necessary, couldn't even provide me with a simple dispute number or advise when or how I'd be contacted. I've been with AGL for a long time and had been perfectly happy. In the current financial climate I could not be more disappointed that they really do not give a **bleep** about their customers.

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

NeilC — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 02:09:19 GMT

@twaltisbuhl

I suggest you read my post above and get your current plan etc.

Why are you getting estimated bills.

The neighbourhood is a place to ask a question from the neighbourhood members, if you are not satisfied you should be actually talking to someone.

Get some facts and then produce them to AGL .

Cheers Neil

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

twaltisbuhl — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 02:17:23 GMT

Thanks Neil

I strongly suggest that AGL actually looks at the facts that I've already presented.

I've done my very best to find information and it is severely lacking.

I've attempted to speak to someone and have only got basic bot responses.

Have you bothered to consider that? No.

Explain to me how a bill more than doubles any previous bill with zero change in usage.

It simply shouldn't and yet, AGL have decided that it did.

If the usage is the same, why would a bill be fluctuating between $70/$80 to $130 to credit to over $250?

It simply wouldn't.

If you have a human being who is willing to have an actual conversation with me and address this issue, I'll be perfectly happy to participate.

You have my contact details.

Until then I'll be keeping a very close eye on my meter read and bills, as clearly AGL is acting unscrupulous.

Thanks
Tanya

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

NeilC — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 02:59:59 GMT

@twaltisbuhl

Tanya,

"Explain to me how a bill more than doubles any previous bill with zero change in usage."

If you are on a single rate tariff then your bill will normally waver around a fairly constant amount.
However if you have changed to a demand tariff, it can dramatically change because of a single days usage.
With a TOU (Time Of Use) tariff, your bill will change depending on when you use the electricity during the day or night.

Hence the reason that I took all that time to document how to get your current tariff.

Don't have any contact details for you other than hitting the reply button below your post.

I am not an employee of AGL, nor have ever been. I joined this neighbourhood so that I could try and help people such as yourself with issues and put you on the right path.

Pick up the phone and wait to get a response or log onto your account and then chat with a real person.

Cheers Neil

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

twaltisbuhl — Mon, 28 Nov 2022 03:06:23 GMT

Thanks Neil

I'll reiterate that nothing has changed. I have not changed to a different plan or tariff.

I've attempted to speak with AGL and have limited 'copy and paste' responses.

I've made my post to this community so that people know they're not the only ones and to try to garner further information for myself.

Thank you for taking your time to assist the community, shame that AGL don't do the same.

Regards

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

AGL-CustomerX — Fri, 02 Dec 2022 14:01:07 GMT

@DHoiberg is it using this link Energy & Water Ombudsman NSW (EWON) ?

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

AGL-CustomerX — Fri, 02 Dec 2022 14:02:27 GMT

@AGLtheftvictim, nice name 🙂 😝

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

AGL-CustomerX — Fri, 02 Dec 2022 14:05:13 GMT

Hi @JeffreyT,

Yes, that could possibly be my issue here.

How to explain that to the AGL customer service team without causing outrageous call-out fees when they send in their technician?

Re: Impossibly high bill - and no options provided except "prove us wrong"

NeilC — Fri, 02 Dec 2022 14:25:45 GMT

@AGL-CustomerX

I think I know you.

Are you William Anchor.

Cheers Neil